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ezFolk Forums > Other Instruments > Erhu > Issues on CITES...A punishable offence under the WAPPRIITA?! |
| Moderated by: Tony Provencher, Richard Hefner | Page: 1 2 3   |
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| Issues on CITES...A punishable offence under the WAPPRIITA?! | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Thu Oct 18th, 2007 03:22 pm |
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1st Post |
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thunderbird Approved 
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Thank you Davidmdahl for indirectly shining more light on the CITES issues. I followed your lead on one of your posts...you mentioned the supplier "Cadenza"...and I went to the site...well...I found something really useful and informative...I would like to share it with the members...here is the excerpt from the site as follows: Cites License and Legal Erhu Imports The clamping down of illegally imported snake skin into China has resulted in the quality of snake skin on Erhus lowering and the prices rising, and many of our friends from Europe and Japan as well as Oceania are not able to import or buy Erhus from overseas. As such, we will like to help them with the importation. All Erhus from Cadenza comes with an import license, which can also be kept to show that the Erhu is made from valid and legal skin sources. At this point in time, Cadenza holds large and legal stocks and are constantly searching for new and better supplies in South East Asia. We will also like to re-instate that responsible Erhu makers, retailers and players should respect the CITES convention, prevent the over-killing and irresponsible poaching of pythons for the sake of our children and their children, so that they can have good Erhus to enjoy in the future. Below is a sample of the CITES license by the Singapore Authorities The 'Golden Card' issued with China Erhus after 2005 is only valid for DOMESTIC use in China. It states clearly that export of any Erhu MUST be with a valid CITES license. Please note carefully that the Erhu must be accompanied with a valid license, license to you, before accepting the instrument, as the unlicensed instrument may be subject to confiscation at any customs. Click on the Picture above to read carefully the fine-print. It is important that you understand the law of CITES to ensure that you can have the erhu safely and assured that the skin on the Erhu is legal. Any inquiries, please do not hesitate to contact us at helpdesk@cadenzamusic.biz ********************************************************* Any updates on the above issues? WAPPRIITA stands for Wild Animal and Plant Protection and International and interprovincial Trade Act. Any similar Act exists in the States? And what are the legal punishments for voilating such Act? How are we going to protect our cash from going down the drain? Why should we take this issue seriously?...well...for one thing...If I am going to spend $800 Canadian dollars on an Erhu...not only I want to make sure that I get what I pay for...I also don't want some officials "knocking on my door" and serve me with a court paper for voilating some wild-life or importation Acts...I just don't want to part with my hard-earn money without a good reason!  Attachment: cites.jpg (Downloaded 200 times)
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| Posted: Thu Oct 18th, 2007 03:24 pm |
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2nd Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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More picture on the internal Chinese Erhu permits! Attachment: citescard.jpg (Downloaded 199 times)
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| Posted: Thu Oct 18th, 2007 03:38 pm |
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3rd Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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The Cadenza also has provided a CITES link as follows: http://www.cites.org/ As a counsumer...I don't feel comfortable spending hundred of my hard-earned cash on high risk items...I suggest who ever can offer me the best price...good guality goods...and risk-free products...this business person would be the ultimate winner...I am...in this case..of course.. refering to my beloved "girlfriends"....those lovely Erhus!
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| Posted: Thu Oct 18th, 2007 08:55 pm |
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4th Post |
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Clyde Approved 
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God Bless Last edited on Thu Jul 10th, 2008 06:44 am by Clyde |
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 01:52 am |
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5th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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I believe it is my moral duty to warn other innocent consumers...before they lost their hard-earned money without getting the products they paid for. This is what our dear Canadians would get from Enviroment Canada if they import Erhu without a CITES permit (please see attached picture)! My understanding is that a CITES permit only cost $20 to $30 USD in Singapore...I really can't understand why people would want to save such a small amount and risking their beloved Erhu worths $400 USD and up in the hands of the customs! I am totally on the consumers side. Just a thought...if consumers really want to take risk...maybe a cash-on-delievery approach is the best policy for protecting their precious Erhu. In other words, I get my Erhu and then you (the seller) get my money. But again, if you take that kind of an approach...you are breaking the law of our land (importation of Erhu without a CITES permit)...I want to make it crystal clear that I do not advocate any law breaking behaviors! One of the Erhu students in our group took that approach to purchase an Erhu online...her $500 USD Erhu was seized but she didn't lose a penny because somehow they (seller and buyer) agree on COD...I still don't know how she managed to reach such an agreement with the seller...why didn't she ask for a CITES permit? Maybe the seller could not provide one (I am just guessing). In conclusion, importation of Erhu (Python Skin) without a CITES permit is a punishable offence under WAPPRIITA section 6(2)...so dear Erhu lovers, please beware of the consequences! Attachment: Dscn1868.jpg (Downloaded 185 times)
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 01:56 am |
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6th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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One more "deadly" paper from Enviroment Canada if you are importing Erhu (python skin) without a CITES permit ! Attachment: Dscn1869.jpg (Downloaded 184 times)
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 02:05 am |
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7th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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I get really upset when I don't get my Erhu and the seller got my money!...I would be singing the blues for the next ten years!
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 02:18 am |
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8th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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Canada, China and United States are among the 172 parties agreed to be bound by the Convention! Excerpt from CITES site:http://www.cites.org/eng/disc/what.shtml "Although CITES is legally binding on the Parties – in other words they have to implement the Convention – it does not take the place of national laws. Rather it provides a framework to be respected by each Party, which has to adopt its own domestic legislation to ensure that CITES is implemented at the national level."
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 08:04 am |
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9th Post |
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tansungwah Approved 
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Thanks for the interesting report thunderbird. An alternative is to buy a man made skin Erhu, which doesn't sound too bad actually....
____________________ Online Store: Erhu Pipa Guzheng Liuqin Ruan Sanxian Yangqin Hulusi Dizi Suona Xiao Chinese Music Instruments Blog Follow me on Twitter! |
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 05:12 pm |
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10th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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tansungwah wrote:Thanks for the interesting report thunderbird. Yes, man-made skin Erhu is nice...however I love the python skin Erhu too...as I said jokingly but to the point...Erhus are like beautiful girls...they have beautiful voices and personalites...I wouldn't want to give up the diversity (real python skin Erhu) just because the government and the Erhu industry can not work together and iron out all the bugs in the system. Basically the sloution is really simple (especially coming from this bird's brain)  ...appropriate governmental Dept can give out the CITES permit at the manufacturing level...inspect the source and the stock of the python skins on site...get the skin certified before production...so every Erhu coming out from the manufacters are all legal...at least theoretical legal...people can always deal with the fake and illegal products like any other fake products on the market after the fact...right now the CITES permit thing is really getting wild and crazy.In the meantime...everyone suffers...the sellers...the buyers...the muscians and the collectors...no one benefit from this confusion and insecurity. I say every new Erhu manufactured in and after 2007 should have all necessarry documents and permits...no more guess work for the consumers and sellers. All Erhu manufactured before 2007 should be grandfathered. Amen! I know it is a bird's dream...a fairy tale...well I hope members can see my point! 
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 05:54 pm |
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11th Post |
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tansungwah Approved
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Well, my Erhus can come with CITES permit, no problems. But of my customers in some countries do not need them and so far(touch wood) there have been no problems. But now I make it a point to tell my Canadian customers that it is a must for them to apply for one. Here is the official website in my country:http://www.ava.gov.sg/AnimalsPetSector/CITESEndangeredSpecies/ I charge US$24 for the certificate. It is used to cover costs like the application fee, parking and toll charges when I go physically collect the certificate from them. Sung Wah
____________________ Online Store: Erhu Pipa Guzheng Liuqin Ruan Sanxian Yangqin Hulusi Dizi Suona Xiao Chinese Music Instruments Blog Follow me on Twitter! |
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| Posted: Sat Oct 20th, 2007 07:06 pm |
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12th Post |
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Clyde Approved
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God Bless Last edited on Thu Jul 10th, 2008 06:45 am by Clyde |
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21st, 2007 04:47 pm |
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13th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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tansungwah wrote:Well, my Erhus can come with CITES permit, no problems. But of my customers in some countries do not need them and so far(touch wood) there have been no problems. I am very happy to hear that you can provide a CITES permit for Canadian Erhu consumers. The cost of $24 USD for one single permit is fair enough considering that you have to pick it (permit) up personally. May I ask, when I order an Erhu from you...do you attach the CITES permit to the shipment (inside the parcel or outside the parcel)?...what is your common practice to make sure that I get what I ordered?...We consumers really need strong assurance from the seller in this matter! I have one last picture to share with the Erhu cmmunity members...the Chinese registration Card clearly indicated that a CITES permit is required for exporting purposes. Attachment: Dscn1874.jpg (Downloaded 169 times)
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| Posted: Sun Oct 21st, 2007 04:50 pm |
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14th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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Front view of the above registration card! Attachment: Dscn1875.jpg (Downloaded 171 times)
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22nd, 2007 02:24 am |
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15th Post |
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tansungwah Approved
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thunderbird wrote: tansungwah wrote: The CITES permit is inside the parcel. If they open up to inspect the Erhu they will see certificate inside. Of course you will get what you ordered and sometimes even more. I post regularly in forums and have a reputation to keep so I will make sure my customers are satisfied. Sung Wah
____________________ Online Store: Erhu Pipa Guzheng Liuqin Ruan Sanxian Yangqin Hulusi Dizi Suona Xiao Chinese Music Instruments Blog Follow me on Twitter! |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22nd, 2007 02:44 am |
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16th Post |
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Clyde Approved
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God Bless Last edited on Thu Jul 10th, 2008 06:45 am by Clyde |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22nd, 2007 02:50 pm |
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17th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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tansungwah wrote:thunderbird wrote:tansungwah wrote: Thank you for giving us (the consumers) such a strong assurance...Clyde must like you a lot...otherwise he wouldn't be speaking for you loudly in such a "high volume" Thank you for your good and informative services provided to the Erhu community...I have not heard any bad thing about your company...keep up your good work!
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22nd, 2007 03:10 pm |
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18th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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Clyde wrote:I can assure you that you can always trust in what Sung Wah says and what he says he will do. Clyde, I would like to respond to your comments but don't know what to say...you leave me speechless. May I remind you that this topic is not about Sung Wah and his company nor his reputation...I have no intention or interest to discuss this kind of matters in a public forum...I only interested in matters that concern consumers and their hard-earned money.
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22nd, 2007 06:26 pm |
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19th Post |
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Clyde Approved
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God Bless Last edited on Thu Jul 10th, 2008 06:46 am by Clyde |
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22nd, 2007 09:24 pm |
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20th Post |
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thunderbird Approved
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Clyde wrote:May I remind you that this topic is not about Sung Wah and his company nor his reputation...I have no intention or interest to discuss this kind of matters in a public forum...I only interested in matters that concern consumers and their hard-earned money. No problem ...my toes are still intact...and no hard feelings!
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