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| Westphalia Waltz origin - Folk Song Histories - General - ezFolk Forums | |||||||||||||||
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Lynn Scoles Approved
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Recently posted this question to the lyrics portion of this forum but also would like to know the origin of the melody Cotton Collins heard in Germany and if it is the same as the one supposedly dating back to 13th-century Province. Does anyone know if there are French lyrics to Westphalia Waltz? I have heard the song is being sung in Canada and one of the web sites (http://www.streetswing.com/histmain/z3waltz.htm) says Westphalia Waltz is from 13th-century Province (France?). On another site (http://www.angelfire.com/folk/polka/texas.html), I read, "Cotton Collins, a fiddle player for the legendary Lone Star Playboys, composed a 'no-name' waltz in 1946 based on a melody that he memorized while stationed in Germany." Dancers in Wesphalia, TX, suggested the song be named Westphalia Waltz. Cotton Collins obtained the copyright for the sheet music. The same site said, "As written, the Westphalia Waltz had no words. Lyrics were added by Hamlet Booker, and the song again recorded by the Lone Star Playboys as 'The New Westphalia Waltz.'" A note from Brian Marshall was added to the same site saying, "The 'Westphalia Waltz' is known in Polish circles as 'Pytala Sie Panni,' which means, 'Why are you sad Lady?' This song has been sung in Bremond (TX) for as long as anyone can remember." I finally found lyrics at the following site: http://lyrics.duble.com/B/bravecombolyrics/bravecombowestphaliawaltzlyrics.htm, but think they are probably Hamlet Booker's words since they mention things like a Texas drawl, Wichita Falls, and San Antone Rose. Since Cotton Collins was basing his song on a melody already in existence, I imagine there could be lyrics for the original song and would like to know what they are. Thank you.
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jcurner Approved
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Lynn, this is not going to be of much use to you, yet. However, a couple of years ago I came across the origin of the Westphalia Walta, and I cannot remember what I found. I do remember this however, and I was surprized, that the waltz and name had nothing to do with Germany. Whatever my source was, it sounded pretty good. . . In a book I have, Contemporary Accordion, there's a note: This tune is from the fine fiddling of Louis Beaudoin (Philo 2000). Again, nothing of help to you there I suppose. However, a year or two ago I was backing up a group with accordion, and the lead singer sang, in French, lyrics to this tune. I can distinctly remember him turning around and saying, "Do you know the Westphalia Waltz?" Anyway, if I ever see this guy again I'll try and get those lyrics. That's it, Beaumont.
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Lynn Scoles Approved
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Thank you for the information. I ran an Internet search on Louis Beaudoin and found his bio at the following site: http://www.artistdirect.com/nad/music/artist/bio/0,,402316,00.html#bio It says he was originally from MA but his family moved to VT. The article also says he was "Considered one of the great Quebec fiddlers," mentions he made several recordings with the Philo label, and that he died in the early 1980's. As for the Westphalia Waltz being of French origin, the article I originally found stated it dated back to 13th-century Province. It is possibly the same one Cotton Collins heard while in Germany, the same as the Polish "Pytala Sie Panni," and the same as a friend heard sung in French while in Canada, however, I have no proof. I don't think the name should have been Westphalia Waltz since that evidently originated from Cotton Collin's version played in Westphalia, TX. Hopefully you will soon run across the singer you mentioned and we will have the answer to the mystery. My husband Fred and I (both classically trained) recently purchased an accordion so I found it interesting to hear you mention your accordion book and the fact you play back up on accordion. Have you played for long? Thanks again for your response. Lynn
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jcurner Approved
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Hi Lynn: Thanks for your reply. The book I referred to is: Contemporary Accordion by Louis Giampetruzzi, published by Oak Publications. Lots of Quebec, Cajun, Irish tunes, including that waltz we're talking about. All the tunes are in standard notation with the bass clef etc. I've been playing button accordion for many years. I have 2 Hohner button accordions, one is a Corso, and the other is a Corona 2. Congratulations on your acquiring an accordion. What type and make etc did you get? Are you just starting to play the accordion. (I love to talk about that stuff.) I hope I can find that guy. I'll try . . . Recently, i had to have my computer re-formatted and I lost everything that was in it. But I belonged to an accordion forum in Louisiana and there was all kinds of information available. The first name of the forum was, not surprizinly, Cajun, but darned if I can remember the rest of the name. You might find it easily. Regards, John
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jcurner Approved
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Lynn: I'm the same guy called Beaumont; I just happened to use my real name on that last message.
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Lynn Scoles Approved
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Hi, John, I did an Internet search and found the Cajun Accordion Discussion Group at http://pub21.bravenet.com/forum/show.php?usernum=1722942123 and Playing the Cajun Accordion Discussion Page at http://pub50.bravenet.com/forum/show.php?usernum=4254394652 Then there is Clarence's List of Cajun, Zydeco and Louisiana Egroup Discussion Forums at http://www.cajunradio.org/egroupforums.html in case you want to participate in any of them. I would be in terrible shape if I lost everything on this computer. I attempt to keep a good backup but I use the computer almost daily for our business, personal affairs, and, up until last year, for all our home schooling records. It I should be backed it up constantly. I just asked my husband about the Contemporary Accordion book you mentioned and he said we don't have it. He is the one who is actually putting in time to learn the instrument. I spent several hours with the accordion when we first got it (I think last summer) because I was really interested in understanding how it worked. We purchased an Excelsior Accordiana on eBay but the buyer allowed us to pick it up (2-hr drive and near my home town). Last night Fred was saying he has progressed enough that he needs one with more switches/sets of reeds. This one has 3 treble switches (2 sets of reeds) and 2 bass switches, 120 bass buttons, and 41 keys. Fred is an accomplished pianist who also plays trombone. I am a violinist and bass clarinetist. I also taught myself piano, flute, guitar, and recorder; and am now working on bones, spoons, and harmonica in order to add some diversity to the NYS fiddling chapter which I joined about 1 1/2 years ago. I am hoping Fred will feel comfortable enough to join us soon with his accordion. Lynn
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jcurner Approved
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Hi Lynn: Wow, what a great interest you have in music and great accomplishments. The author of Contemporary Accordion is a piano accordion player and the tunes are arranged for piano accordion. I'm pretty sure one of the sites you mentionned is the Cajun site I was registered with ( I'll give it a try a little later). There is some piano accordion participation but mainly I think it's button. The knowledge that some of these people have about music theory and hands-on, astounds me. In recent years the accordion sound is much desired as back-up for groups. Lynn, for Heaven's sakes, back-up the valuable stuff you have on your computer. In my case, a month ago, all of a sudden there were no icons appearing. The whole thing was frozen. Working with Dell, day 1 and then day 2, the problem could not be fixed, so on day 3 they told me the computer would have to be re-formatted. She asked me, "Do you have anything on your computer that you want to save?" I said, "No," because I was so happy that she sounded confident that it could be fixed. So the computer was emptied out, just like it came off the store shelf. It was only afterwards that I thought of some things I should have saved, e.g. Band in a Box, e-mail addresses, etc. But I'm finding I can gradually replace everything, not Band in a Box however unless I'm willing to shell out a hundred bucks or more. Now, I know one of these days I'll run into that guy who sang Westphalia Waltz. I'll get back to you. Occassionally, I'll give the spoons a go with a group, and believe it or not they give me compliments. And I don't know how to play the spoons. I just take 2 large table spoons and quietly get a beat going; I don't try any fancy stuff because I'd make a fool of myself. And I make sure my spoon beat is not very loud. Another little accompaniment I try, especially something of a Latin or Calypso beat, are 2 little balls filled with something that rattles. I don't even know the name of the balls. Maybe it's some kind of sand in the balls but you often hear the same sound in Calpyso music etc. Isn't that something I don't know the name of those balls Just as a matter of interest, my main music interest is singing and accompaning myself on acoustic guitar for elderly people. 6 nights a week. Usually solo but with the odd exception. There's a girl next door who sings in a band, so occasionnaly she joins me to sing songs in French. But entertaining these old people is a real joy. They couldn't care less about the odd mistake. I say to them, " How come you don't get sick and tired of me?" But, they don't seem to. Great fun . . . All the best to you both, John
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jcurner Approved
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Lynn, if you haven't already, try entering Westphalia Walta on GOOGLE and open IMAGES. There's some interesting stuff on there related to our elusive waltz. John
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jcurner Approved
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Lynn, I'm doing an awful lot of talking today, ha. Anyway, I came across a lot of history on the Westphalia Waltz. Try and bring up the following: http://www.angelfine.com/folk/polka/texas.html-105k. Scroll down a long ways and there it is . . . Also, here's another site where i found "the words" to the waltz. Maybe. http://www.pgoelz.com/westphal1.html-3k. John
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Lynn Scoles Approved
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Hi, John, I do back up my computer every so often. I was just saying that I use it so much I should probably back it up on more of a daily basis. I think the problem you had was you told the Dell technician you had nothing you wanted saved before reformatting. Even when a computer is frozen, the hard drive data can usually be saved. We had that problem years ago and more recently my younger son had the problem. My older son helped us transfer the hard drive contents to another computer before reformatting. The balls you said you used were probably rhythm eggs which I have and use for backup. They are shaped like eggs and have small steel ball bearings or similar objects in them to make a sound like shifting sand. I bought two after seeing them used by a member of a folk group. They added nice diversity to the music. You can vary the sound of the rhythm eggs a lot by how you hold and shake them. I also saw spoons and bones played so bought them too but also bought instruction books including DVD and CD. The instructions were extremely helpful. Neither instrument takes very much effort to learn enough to supply decent backup. The DVD "How to Play The Spoons: Music from the Kitchen" is by "Spoon Man" Jim Cruise. The bones CD "How to Play the Bones" is by Sue Ellen Barber in collaboration with bones player and demonstrator Percy Danforth. I also recently took out the harmonica I bought as a child and began practicing. Maybe by spring I will be playing a few of the tunes we play. I have memorized a couple Christmas songs and Amazing Grace. I Googled Westphalia Waltz and opened "Images." I don't think I ever realized those top links existed before. Thanks. I couldn't find the part of the angelfine site you listed and could only reach the site by truncating the link to http://www.angelfine.com. However, I was able to view the pgoelz site and print out the page. Like pgoelz says, the words don't seem to fit the music we have either so maybe the Polish song "Pytala Sie Panni" is a different song. Maybe the translation is a poor one since it really doesn't make good sense and elsewhere I found the title meant "Why are you sad Lady" not "A lady is asking." Lynn
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jcurner Approved
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Hi Lynn, nice to hear from you. Lynn, I don't think you found the site giving the history of the Waltz? It's in an article entitled: Polka in Texas, and the history of the waltz is entitled: Wonderful Westphaliz Waltz. The address is: http://www.angelfire.com/folk/polka/texas.html. Please let me know how you make out because if negative I can transcribe it and send the history to you in a message. Yes I really like those rhythm eggs. When the guitar guys have their capoes on, I have to put the accordion aside, but I kid them that they can play in any key they want, ha. Same with the spoons. This Thursday night I'm playing with the same band, the guy who sang the Waltz in French. I'll get back to you. Cheers, John
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banjo brad Super Moderator 
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Lynn- Maybe the tune is different because the author (Texan), based his composition on a song he memorized while in Germany in the war. Minds can do strange things when trying to remember stuff. Still probably just a pretty. I love the waltz and have it as a goal in my fiddle learning project. I can do a fair melody line on guitar.  Keep on pickin'Brad
____________________ ezFolk Help Brad Prickly Pear Music Banjo Brad's ezFolk page TOTMC |
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| ezFolk Forums > General > Folk Song Histories > Westphalia Waltz origin | |
