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| Moderated by: Tony Provencher, Richard Hefner | Page: 1 2   |
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| Machine Heads/ Tuning Pegs on a lot of new ukes... | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Fri Nov 23rd, 2007 12:31 pm |
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1st Post |
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Jamshed Approved
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Bonjour, this is my first posting here. I play all sorts of music on all sorts of instruments. Ukes are among my favourites (others are Electric bass, Indian Harmonium, lektryk & akoostyk six string devils, glockenspiel). Anyway... Why is it that so many new ukes are fitted with guitar-like machine heads. I bought reasonably good tenor (Ashbury) and it had guitar-type machine heads and it rendered it almost useless because it was so neck heavy. I took them off and replaced them with some proper cheap (but efficient) 99p plasic uke pegs and it was fine! In a shop near me, they are selling dozens of good cheap treble ukes for (mainly) kids to learn music on. They are all nice striking colours and quite playable except for the same problem: geared tuners that just make the uke want to hit the floor neck first! I know machine heads make tuning easier but that "pro" totally outweighs the "con"s of instrument inbalance, n'est que pas? And surely it would be cheaper for the makers to use proper uke pegs. What are your esteemed opinions?
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| Posted: Fri Nov 23rd, 2007 06:07 pm |
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2nd Post |
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TomHB Guest
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Hi Jamshed and welcome. IMO basic geared machines are probably just cheaper and easier for manufacturers to install and have work *smoothly*. Just drill a hole and slap them on. Wood and plastic violin-style pegs need to be fit with care and precision to work correctly. On the other hand, I've become a convert to the Grover 2b pegs (with bushings). I only have 2 ukes so far -- one Oscar Schmidt with geared machine tuners (neck-heavy, and body heavy too, with Koa lam) and a Fluke with the Grover 1:1 pegs -- and I far prefer the Grover pegs now. My next uke will be a traditional thin solid wood build, with Grover pegs (or similar). Tom P. Last edited on Fri Nov 23rd, 2007 07:18 pm by |
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| Posted: Fri Nov 23rd, 2007 10:26 pm |
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3rd Post |
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ukepimp Approved 
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welcome to the best ukulele forum around. as far as machine hear geared tuners versus friction tuners, i definitely HAVE to have geared tuners. most geared tuners are what they consider 16 to 1 ratio tuners. in other words, it takes approximately 16 turns of the tuner to turn the tuning post 1 time around, which definitely makes it easier to tune. with friction tuners, the ratio is 1 to 1. that means for every 1 turn of the tuners, the tuning post turns 1 time around. sometimes to get it tuned that 1/16 of a note is very difficult, even to the most experienced 'ukulele player. they may be heavy, and not very cost effective, but they give you more comfort and ease when you're trying to get as close to 440 tuning as possible. for me, like i mentioned, i HAVE to have geared machine head tuners. even on my son's $29 Leolani soprano entry level 'ukulele, i made sure they had geared machine head tuners on it. haha.
____________________ http://ezfolk.com/audio/Dennis_Kaieamakoa_Nakamoto http://www.myspace.com/dennisnakamoto http://www.myspace.com/ukehutguam DON'T THINK.......JUST PICK!!!! |
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| Posted: Sun Nov 25th, 2007 12:34 am |
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4th Post |
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TomHB Guest
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I have no problem tuning my Fluke to 440 with 1:1 Grover pegs. However, I am a bit surprised that a longtime, accomplished uke player is endorsing geared machines over pegs. But I'm not endorsed by any manufacturer, and my opinion is just my opinion. Tom
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| Posted: Sun Nov 25th, 2007 04:37 am |
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5th Post |
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UkeForever Approved 
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Like so many things in the ukulele world, this is a matter of preference. Certainly the "traditional" look is NOT machine tuners. But they are admittedly easier to tune. I can understand why session stage performers like Jake Shimabukuro and James Hill would have geared tuners on their main axes--they can be tuned on the fly. I prefer the traditional 1:1 friction tuners for purely aesthetic reasons. I do have one ukulele with geared tuners, and they work wonderfully for tuning on the fly, but they just don't look quite right to me. I would much rather perform with a traditional looking instrument, but that's just me. BTW, a good set of geared tuners can be far more expensive than any 1:1 tuner. There is a brand called "pegheds" that look like traditional violing pegs, but are geared inside. These are a great compromise, though I think they're still a bit too bulky for a soprano ukulele.
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| Posted: Sun Nov 25th, 2007 08:34 am |
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6th Post |
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TomHB Guest
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I completely understand why folks would favor geared tuners, and maybe I'm spoiled by the fact that a Fluke stays in tune so well. And maybe I'm just trying to rattle the cage a bit as well  I do see the uke as an instrument with a long tradition, however, and from henceforth, my ukes will all have 1:1 pegs. Also leaning to your idea of the soprano being the ideal, ukeforever. I only have a cheap Mahalo soprano now, but I always get a kick playing the little thing (even with it's "toy" sound). Gonna get a *good* soprano next. The Fluke tenor sure has a pretty tone, though.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 07:46 am |
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7th Post |
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Jamshed Approved
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This question of "tuners" over pegs is more to do with "playability". It's not aesthetics (although pegs do look much better) nor laziness in tuning technique. One just can't play properly if you are having to hold the weight of the instrument up with your left hand (if you're right handed). The left hand has to be free to finger properly. This is true of all stringed instruments. I can't think of an exception.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 09:00 am |
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8th Post |
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ukepimp Approved
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TomHB wrote: I have no problem tuning my Fluke to 440 with 1:1 Grover pegs. well, i too have no problem tuning a fluke, or any ukulele with 1:1 pegs to 440. and you'd be surprised how many accomplished 'ukulele players endorsed geared tuners over friction pegs. i'm not sure if you play on stage, and have had your instrument, whether 'ukulele, or any form or guitar go off tune from constant playing, but it definitely makes it a lot easier get my instrument back in tune with geared tuners. it's not that i'm "endorsing" friction pegs or geared tuners. i manage an 'ukulele shop, and I endorse what is comfortable to the player. understandably Tom, that is your opinion, and I definitely welcome it. but, as far as somebody gaining sponsorship from a major 'ukulele manufacturer has nothing to do with their tuning ability or what kind of tuners they prefer on their 'ukulele.
____________________ http://ezfolk.com/audio/Dennis_Kaieamakoa_Nakamoto http://www.myspace.com/dennisnakamoto http://www.myspace.com/ukehutguam DON'T THINK.......JUST PICK!!!! |
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 09:40 am |
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9th Post |
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infinities Approved 
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UkeForever wrotePegheds are just sooo smooth.. but yep, they might look a bit bulky on a Soprano. I have a set on my W. King Tenor, I wanted the traditional look, so I asked him to install a set. OTOH, I have this Bushman Soprano that has the stock plastic pegs.. they seem to hold tune suprising well, just more sensitive to tune vs. a geared one. Also have a Pono tenor w/geared and it doesnt seem to be overly neck-heavy.. but like ukepimp means, geared is faster and more accurate to tune on the fly. BTW, there are some junk geared tuners around too.. turn it and nothing happens.. wtf? or the string gets looser from something slipping..
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 10:10 am |
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10th Post |
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TomHB Guest
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Ukepimp, I understand the rationale that geared tuners are just easier for folks to use, and easier for manufacturers to install. I don't play uke on stage (yet) but I can't imagine that an audience would walk out if I took a few moments longer to tune via pegs. They may walk out due to my playing, of course  I just don't think the instrument should be compromised (with geared tuners) only to make it more accessable to the masses. On the other hand, I've got a Fluke (plastic body and fretboard), so who am I to talk? I dunno. Just seems like geared tuners belong on guitars. Not ukes, or violins. 
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 12:57 pm |
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11th Post |
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Jamshed Approved
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If you hold any uke, bass, banjo, six string devil , even a bouzouki et cetera loosely where the neck joins the body and the neck end is heavier: THE INSTRUMENT IS SCHEIT/ BOLLOX/ USELESS. Anyone who ignores this maxim is either an uninformed amateur, a stupid poseur (or is that "poster"?!) that can't really play or an idiot. The attachment shows the good cheap tuners (I believe these are Grovers). In London I can get this sort of thing for 99p each. They have to be cheaper, lighter and just as easy tune after two minute's practice with them than any geared tuner. Go for this type not some trendy, gimmick-y, expensive techy nerd nonsense like "pegheads". If I had a shop selling ukes and cared about whether my goods were playable or not, I'd swop all the nasty heavy geared tuners on my stock to cheap pegs so that my inexperienced learner clients could actually start playing properly and not have to struggle with some unnecessarily ill-balanced (perhaps half-decent) instrument that performs like a piece of junk. Long make you all PLUNKA PLUNKA!!! Attachment: CA1O8RHH.jpg (Downloaded 75 times)
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 04:57 pm |
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12th Post |
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jerrypro Approved 
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""Anyone who ignores this maxim is either an uninformed amateur, a stupid poseur (or is that "poster"?!) that can't really play or an idiot."" Thanks for your accurate description of the majority of posters to this forum, including myself. We all hope to be as enlightened as you someday. Until then, I'll not only continue ignoreing your "maxim" but your arrogant posts as well. I am truly unworthy, jerry 
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 05:11 pm |
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13th Post |
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Neal Approved 
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Jamshed wrote: If you hold any uke, bass, banjo, six string devil , even a bouzouki et cetera loosely where the neck joins the body and the neck end is heavier: THE INSTRUMENT IS SCHEIT/ BOLLOX/ USELESS.This subject comes up from time to time, along with the "how do you pronounce ukulele" subject. Both usually cause bad manners to come forth. Carry on.
____________________ http://ezfolk.com/audio/NealPaisley http://www.youtube.com/nealpaisley http://www.myspace.com/nealpaisley |
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 05:16 pm |
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14th Post |
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UkeForever Approved
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Jamshed wrote: If you hold any uke, bass, banjo, six string devil , even a bouzouki et cetera loosely where the neck joins the body and the neck end is heavier: THE INSTRUMENT IS SCHEIT/ BOLLOX/ USELESS. Now come on Jamshed--that's just a silly thing to write. I get that you feel strongly about this--I also feel strongly about using inconspicuous tuners, but modern geared tuners for uke aren't really that heavy. Besides, many competent players use straps to compensate for a heavier neck. Even my Kanile'a with its machine tuners isn't that much more top heavy. I think Jake S and James H both use straps and geared tuners. Do they fall into the above category? If they do, I can't wait to hear your music. Link us up, baby. Tom HB--are you BeachBumTom? Last edited on Mon Nov 26th, 2007 05:17 pm by UkeForever |
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 06:09 pm |
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15th Post |
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TomHB Guest
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"Tom HB--are you BeachBumTom?" Nope. Been oft accused of being a beach bum, and am named Tom, but that's not me. I'm sure he's a great guy though ;o) BTW, whatever floats folk's boat is fine with me, regarding tuners. I just see the uke as a traditional instrument, and 1:1 pegs seem appropriate. All my guitars and dobros etc. have geared machines (of course), but I think I'll stick to pegs for my future ukes. I'm sure it's been discussed here previously, but it seems that the tone would be better with less "machinery", as well. At least when played unamplified.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 06:23 pm |
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16th Post |
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UkeForever Approved
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Oh, I figured the HB stands for Huntington Beach, and there's this guy BBT over there...well, you know. I think he has a Fluke too. Whereabouts are you in SoCal? I'm in the Riverside area.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 06:41 pm |
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17th Post |
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TomHB Guest
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I'm in HB. Been here well over 30 years. Have some relatives in Rialto (was born there) and am very familiar with Riverside and Moreno Valley (and water skiing on Lake Perris). Bought my Fluke at Island Bazaar in HB.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 08:23 pm |
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18th Post |
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GX9901 Approved 
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For looks, I very slightly prefer the friction tuners. But geared tuners really are easier to tune, and they look just fine to me. Yes, they are heavier, but it's not like I'm about to get a hernia from holding a uke with geared tuners for an hour. It's all relative. I have a couple of ukes where the neck end is heavier than the body, but it never really bothered me. I can see how it would be a problem if it was so heavy that I struggle to hold it up period, but I don't think such an ukulele exists. Does it?
____________________ Check out my uke blog: http://gx9901ukes.blogspot.com |
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 09:19 pm |
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19th Post |
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Will Approved 
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ukepimp wrote: welcome to the best ukulele forum around. Ah, yes, the age-old "form vs. function" debate. I'd rather have an instrument that is easy to tune than a prettier instrument that is more difficult to tune. I use mandolin straps on my tenors and baritones, so the neck-heavy point is moot for me. I also play 12-string guitars, which are almost invariably neck-heavy, but a good leather strap compensates for the balance problem.
____________________ Will http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/297/ Loose Change & Friends http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/245/ http://loosechangeandfriends.com The Earth Tones http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/337/ A Bunch Of Coconuts http://abunchofcoconuts.com |
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| Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 10:13 pm |
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20th Post |
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TomHB Guest
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Just sampled some of John's songs. Bitter, "Kos Kid" stuff. Not my cup. edit: I do hope he writes a song about me, though I've probably not annoyed him quite enough yet... Every song is from negativity, John. But hey, a free nation. Saludos. Last edited on Mon Nov 26th, 2007 10:31 pm by |
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