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| Moderated by: Richard Hefner | Page:   1 2 3 |
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| Does Price equal quality? - Beginner Questions - Ukulele - Ukulele - ezFolk Forums | |||||||||||||||
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sano Approved 
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Wow, Will, you struck gold! My experience and skill is pretty limited, but I've always had a special thing for archtop guitars. They're just beautiful. But I'm more than happy now with my little uke. It's a beauty too. I haven't been able to compare it directly with others yet (I've got 2 more still in the mail), but I'm impressed. And my wife is trying to play it as I write, which makes me smile. She never picks up my guitar. It's great being able to contact musicians in this forum. I feel a lot of respect among members here and never feel put down, even as a novice. I really love music, always have. It gives me a thrill even when I play as poorly as I do.... 
____________________ sano |
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PJ Approved
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I think some of you guys collect more than I do. I'm beginning to accept my acquisition compulsion and feel normal. I've reserved a Risa semi=hollow bodied, electric, soprano ukulele with metal strings. My 'inner-rocker' is very pleased. I'll play it next week before I buy it. It was a hard choice between the tenor and the soprano, because the tenor has a double pick-up, and the soprano has one. I decided on smaller and more portable; because, there's an amp to be carried as well. Besides, I can reach better on the soprano, and they're very cute. Does anybody own one of these? If so, I'm curious about your experience with it. This is going to require learning some cool guitar riffs, and a new repertoire. I suspect the instrument is more guitar-like than ukulele in sound. Gee, i fall 'off the wagon' easily.
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Neal Approved 
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That Continental is what I was wow'ing about in the post above. It's odd, being a staunch supporter of US interest, what the Chinese are able to produce, and what's available here. We'll know in a few years if these great Chinese instruments last, but I suspect they will. As to price, it was in the 20's that Martin sold the 5K uke for around 40 bucks, which was a serious amount of money back then, but still affordable compared to what one brings now. All of the Chinese ukes are finished in Polyurethane, which isn't bad, but it doesn't move. I wonder what these will sound like in 20-? years, and if they'll be sought after. My guess is they'll be ok. Now, of course this brings on a whole new topic, that of buying foreign, but I hope we won't have to go there in this particular thread.
____________________ http://ezfolk.com/audio/NealPaisley http://www.youtube.com/nealpaisley http://www.myspace.com/nealpaisley |
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sano Approved
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All of the Chinese ukes are finished in Polyurethane, which isn't bad, but it doesn't move. I wonder what these will sound like in 20-? years, and if they'll be sought after. My guess is they'll be ok. Your point about finishes is interesting. I've always been partial to the thin laquering and/or waxing/polishing of wooden instruments rather than the heavier polyurethane (matt or gloss). I floated the idea with a luthier that polyurethane might have an advantage though when it came to strengthening the integrity of the wood and making it more crack resistant. He wasn't convinced (and avoids the "polyury)" - or else he was just trying to sell an instrument (which I couldn't afford anyway.) My new Tangi has a high gloss, and it disappointed me for a few seconds (the photo looked less glossy). But then I saw that it was very nicely applied, and the lovely grain was bookmatched in a way that accentuated rather than detracted. I once read a comment about the Tangi being ugly, but I like it a lot. It sings. I believe what they say about good koa now. I don't know where this 'uk would stand in a comparison test, but it matched or exceeded my expectations. I'm using freemont polycarbons. The action is at 4mm the 12th fret (from the wood, not the fretwire), which seems just a tad high... What do you think? Any opinions out there, or is ideal action all relative to other factors like personal preference and playing style? What would be considered too high? Only when the strings go out of tune when they're chorded or else when it's just to damn hard to chord?
____________________ sano |
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Gaby Approved 
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Action...One of those things... Sure there are conventions (some say 3mm is the best, and so forth), but more often than not, personal preference is different. I set my ukes up relatively high. I love the tone and increased sustain you get. I tried low action, but found it annoying because I fingerpick and found that much harder with a low action. Yes, it's a little bit harder work with the higher action, but it's only four little nylon strings, so it doesn't worry me. (Some may mention intonation in this context. I am not so obsessed with that. As long as my reasonably trained ear can't hear a problem, it's fine with me (sure, the tuner might pick up a minute intonation variance, but I challenge any human to actually hear it). I reckon half the time players press the strings too hard anyway, causing notes to go sharp no matter how perfect the intonation of the uke is). Mind you, I play concert sized ukes, and I would definitely have lower action on a bigger sized uke as the tension gets much higher. You just have to experiment. A saddle is easily replaced if you stuffed up  Last edited on Mon Jun 16th, 2008 02:48 pm by Gaby |
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Neal Approved
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What Gaby said... except I like low action.
____________________ http://ezfolk.com/audio/NealPaisley http://www.youtube.com/nealpaisley http://www.myspace.com/nealpaisley |
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railroadbill Approved
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"Does Price equal quality?" In a word...NO. To elaborate, many lower priced instruments(from small lesser known manufacturers) are fine alternatives to much more pricey "Major Manufacturer" instruments. The feel, and sound of an instrument cannot be directly related to the retail selling price. Of course feel and sound are subjective and what feels and sounds good to me may be "junk" to you. By the same token, what feels and sounds good to you may be an over-priced "pay for the name" rip off to me.
____________________ "the music draws you up a valley, & across a mountain . . . ya gather round it like yer gathering around a fountain . . that was not made by the hands of men." |
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ichadwick Approved 
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Neal wrote: Man! Those Chinese. Making some nice stuff. I ... All I can say is price/value ratio is huge. So is the job loss. For every Chinese-made product we buy, we kiss off another 10-20-100 or more Canadian and American jobs. Buying should be based on some ethical principles, not just price. Sorry, I'm not trying to get on a soap box, but I've seen local industry decimated by offshoring - two factories in the last five years alone. People working in these factories at good wages end up greeters at Wal Mart or housecleaning 12 hours a day to make ends meet. Houses are lost, families destroyed, communities broken apart. All because we treasure a bargain more than a sustainable economy and local jobs. Susan and I try our best not to buy offshore products, try to buy in local stores, and not big box outlets. It's not always possible, it's never easy, but we both feel it's the right thing to do. So for us, price doesn't necessarily equal quality: but the source does.
____________________ Ian ------------------------------------------- Ukulele reviews: http://www.ianchadwick.com/essays/ukuleles.htm Harmonica reviews: http://www.ianchadwick.com/essays/harmonicas.htm |
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Neal Approved
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Ian, I feel your pain. However, if North American company "A" makes a widget for 300 dollars, and Chinese company "B" makes a much better widget for 100 dollars, then that says something about North America's values, not our purchasing habits. I certainly wanted to avoid this particular subject, as no one wins, and it turns into a urinating contest all around. You'll have to trust me on that last bit  .
____________________ http://ezfolk.com/audio/NealPaisley http://www.youtube.com/nealpaisley http://www.myspace.com/nealpaisley |
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ichadwick Approved
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Neal wrote: ...if North American company "A" makes a widget for 300 dollars, and Chinese company "B" makes a much better widget for 100 dollars, then that says something about North America's values, not our purchasing habits. Agreed, we can stop arguing. But "better"? That's another argument - we can save it for another forum. Just FYI - ukes aside - one plant here made some of the best mag car wheels in North America for $38 each. The auto company dropped the contract to use Chinese imports that cost $35 each. 200-300 employees lost their jobs for a $3-a-wheel difference. Some lost homes, others had to cancel their kids' university schooling. If you were one of those employees, would you or your family ever buy a car from that company again in your lifetime? And they'll tell their kids, their relatives, their friends and neighbours... and at least some of those will do the same. For a $12-per-car profit they lost the loyalty of hundreds, even thousands of people, and the loss of thousands of vehicle sales over a lifetime. Was it worth it?
____________________ Ian ------------------------------------------- Ukulele reviews: http://www.ianchadwick.com/essays/ukuleles.htm Harmonica reviews: http://www.ianchadwick.com/essays/harmonicas.htm |
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sano Approved
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Pardon the long post, but "hear what I've gotta say." I'm going to stick my neck out, and in the spirit of the original question that started this thread, "Does price equal quality?" suggest 3 tremendous buys, which happen to be the 3 'uks I've recently bought. I did what any smart (I'm reasonably so I think) consumer does before buying: learn as much as one can, hunt down all the available choices, read reviews, ask lots of questions (and I have in this forum) and listen to advice, and read more, and then ask more questions. Be a pain in the butt if necessary. Obviously it's also helpful to try out as many instruments as possible, though in my circumstance, that wasn't an option. So, in the absence of a drum roll, maybe some of can do some wild flamenco strumming on your 'uks or else just rattle your rolexes: 1. Applause UAE-20 acoustic/electric soprano: When it's not plugged in, it certainly sounds like the runt of the litter, a cross between a toy and serious instrument. I don't know what strings are on it, but may be clear freemonts. In other words, this might be about as good as it gets. But, it intonates well, is very comfortable to play, and is very, very cute. It's a great practice instrument, and because it's half plastic (it being an Ovation), I won't be afraid to play it in my garden. I also have a power outlet on my patio . And when plugged in, it does sound great. It does have a solid spruce top, and unlike the solid bodied electrics or the risa-sticks, it's acoustic and sounds that way. Gee, it sort of reminds me of my Epiphone Casino! It doesn't amplify evenly however, a complaint I've heard from others. The middle strings are louder than the outers, and though I can compensate a bit with my strumming technique, this is something I have to address. I'd hate to send it back! If anyone can advise on this, I'll be very grateful! This review is based on only a couple hours playing (it just came today), but i form attachments easily. I've gotta give this one a good name, maybe "lil runt".2. Tangi solid koa soprano: a great value, especially if you get it at reserve price at MGM's auction! I feel so privileged to be able to have a koa instrument. It may not be the best out there, but it truly sings. I've been playing it for only a few days. Great volume for a soprano that rivals my tenor, and even with my limited playing skills, I can hear a complexity in the sound that rivals a very good bottle of cabernet sauvignon (now fellas, gals, let's not turn this into a wine discussion!). This 'uk deserves comment by a more able player than me. 3. Kala solid spruce top tenor. What a behemoth beside the others! I'm so glad I didn't let the detractors put me off this 'uk. It's great! It's got volume, tone, sustain. It's like a big honking dreadnaught that really gives me a sense of freedom after learning new chords on one of its baby cousins. I can't find anything not to like about this. It just came today too. Yeah, I think I practised for 5 hours today on these three. I feel I've successfully shopped for 3 good budget 'uks that each have very distinct personalities. I can never get bored wit these 3. Maybe someone else wants to suggest their own "best buys" (and this is not a corporate plug!) I don't want to say it, but what the heck. None of these were selling at WalMart, so I didn't have to face that ethical dilemma. I don't think any children were exploited either. And since I don't currently have any pets, no animals will be subjected to cruel abuse at the hands of my practising either. The birds can damn well vacate my garden while I'm practising if they don't like it!
____________________ sano |
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sano Approved
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I'm double posting because I can get away with it this time of morning. I'm not much of a reviewer, but I promise in the future to avoid overusing the word "great." Even if it is such a great word... Call me an aging hippie, but... we can all be practical, pragmatic, polemical, political or whatever, but isn't music about a lot of other stuff? I mean, I grew up eating politics for breakfast, read Marx after school and was for a time a hot-blooded argumentarian and a lot of other stuff, but music has become for me a bit of salvation from all that. Our friend above makes valid points that CBC viewers were reminded of last night with the replay of the "Wal Town" documentary. It's very concerning that WalMart owns %10 of Canadian retailing (or maybe it's %10 of our total economy). Just looking for the cheapest price is surely a race to the bottom, but I don't think forum members are thinking just about what's cheapest. We're all about quality here, aren't we, man? Music, that manna from heaven.... OK, maybe I'm taking this too far in the other direction, but, man, isn't buying a ukulele responsible ethical activism in itself? Play on! Last edited on Tue Jun 17th, 2008 07:49 am by sano ____________________ sano |
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Will Approved 
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ichadwick wrote: Neal wrote:Man! Those Chinese. Making some nice stuff. I ... All I can say is price/value ratio is huge. For the record, I own a U.S.-made Martin Custom Spruce & Rosewood dreadnought (made specifically for Musician's Friend), 3 Canadian-made Seagull guitars (parlour, dreadnought, and 12-string - none of them over $400), and an American-made lap dulcimer. Every other instrument is imported, mostly from China or Korea. Aside from a $3,300 Wesi organ made in Germany that I bought in 1986 (and had to build from a kit and take 2 years of payments to pay off), I don't own any other musical instruments that cost over $800 (the Martin is one of the them, my McSpadden Evoharp autoharp is the other). For someone married with 2 kids, who likes to learn to play a variety of instruments, affordability is a big issue. I moonlight teaching part-time at the local community college to pay for the instruments. Last edited on Tue Jun 17th, 2008 06:27 pm by Will ____________________ Will http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/297/ Loose Change & Friends http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/245/ http://loosechangeandfriends.com The Earth Tones http://ezfolk.com/audio/bands/337/ A Bunch Of Coconuts http://abunchofcoconuts.com |
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UkeForever Approved 
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To address the original question of the post, yes. It is one's definition of "quality" that makes the difference in this discussion. To many, the mainstream manufacturers (American, Canadian, overseas--take your pick) produce "quality" instruments--that is, they intonate well, play nicely, sound good, and have a generally nice finish. With the definition above in mind, one could amass quite a collection of "quality" instruments. Which is fine. This is the road that some collectors/players take. To me, this road leads to a bunch of average instruments that are more or less (to me) uninspiring. To me, there's nothing inspiring about a Kala or an Ovation. I just don't care to pick one up and play it. I'm not a snob--it's just that the cookie cutter look leaves me quite cold, and I have to be inspired to play good music. That includes being inspired by my instrument. When I'm looking at instruments to own and play, I tend to go through a different kind of process to evaluate quality: 1) Does the instrument add something unique or new to my collection? (That almost always gets a yes--too easy.) What I mean by this is a unique sound or look. (OK, still too easy.) 2) Is the instrument of heirloom quality? 3) Will the instrument appreciate or at least hold its value? (These last two questions are a major narrowing in the road.) 4) Are the makers of the instrument from a factory where they are paid a quality wage? These questions make it very difficult to acquire a new "quality" instrument. And they do cause me to lean in the direction of private makers (though I only own two such instruments currently). But when I do acquire an instrument using these questions, it is more of a "keeper" than a mass-manufactured cookie cutter instrument. On the guitar side, I have to say that there is something different about the feel of, say, a high-end Martin or "factory Botique" instrument like Goodall, Collings, or the like. In those cases, I'd say a higher price does equal quality. Last edited on Tue Jun 17th, 2008 03:56 pm by UkeForever ____________________ Don't let the door hit 'ya where the good Lord split 'ya. John Rockwell's Crazy Songs 
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| ezFolk Forums > Ukulele > Beginner Questions - Ukulele > Does Price equal quality? | |
