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| Moderated by: Richard Hefner | Page: 1 2 3   |
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| Tsugaru Shamisen - Other Instruments - Other Instruments - ezFolk Forums | |||||||||||||||
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Tsugaru Approved 
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Hey, rule of thumb; prices reflect the esthetics of the bekko as much as the quality/durability. Remember that the real bekko bachi are made from a natural material so no two are the same. Even the most expensive of bachi will chip and break if not used properly, and that this is particularly true with the "heavier" tsugaru playing style. And I suppose this is more likely to happen as a beginner. no matter who you buy from, you should stick to a plastic/wooden bachi until you develop your playing style to the point where you're less likely to break the bachi. The cheapest ones are not real bekko, but "bekko-fuu The only thing I really know about the quality of bekko is that the more black or dark spots there are, the poorer the quality and the more easily they chip. (more expensive ones at the top of the page use natural materials instead of plastic) Attachment: 19002.jpg (Downloaded 144 times) Last edited on Mon May 5th, 2008 10:41 pm by Tsugaru |
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AllenZ Approved 
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Very good, but one thing about the Bekkoufu, I used one since the beginning when I was using a Fake skin and its great. Very rich tone compared to plastic, but just alittle stiff. The quality Bekkoufu or Bekkouchou I got from my Kyoto is made by the professional shop and is a blend of the real with fiber. Flexibility with duralibilty. And your right, you should stick with the other stuff before bekkou if your beginning, but use a neo fiber bekkou. I personally tried and used one for over a year and I can say I'm still keeping it even though you know I have two bekkou. The more clear it is, the more valuable, but the supply of bekko is near gone because of the Washington Treaty of Japan and not to mention, they are not breeding them to retain the supply, so there's no CITES certificate for legal export. Some player complain that if you use Nylon strings for the 2nd string, it hurts the bachi more. But there isn't really reason to use nylon for the 2nd strings.... No idea what's that about. Attachment: 90010b811.jpg (Downloaded 140 times) Last edited on Fri May 9th, 2008 02:31 am by AllenZ ____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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Tsugaru Approved
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Wow, I didn't know they farm them for their shells. All the reason to get one while you still can I guess. I just wish I could go to a store and hold a few to see which one felt best for ME. Oh well
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AllenZ Approved
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You're right Tsugaru. All stores say they can only make Bekko Bachi with the shells they have left over in stock. They can't get new shells because of laws. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tortoiseshell_material Soon, we'll all have to use "Tortex", the scientific fiber material that mimics the properties of Bekko. Its the same stuff they use in Neo Bekko/Bekkocho/Bekkofu ones. Too bad they just can't bred them to solve the situation. The instrument, the Erhu uses Python skin for the kawa (skin) for the resonator box but the supply was moving towards the same problem with Bekko, so they develop programs to bred them and keep their supplies plentiful, so now Erhu players are safe. Attachment: TPBT01-tn.jpg (Downloaded 138 times) Last edited on Fri May 9th, 2008 04:48 am by AllenZ ____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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AllenZ Approved
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I found one of the shops the Yoshida Brother order their Bekko Bachi from..... They have on site the basic models they always buy: Pretty normal looking model. Plastic handles, Hard Tip, Middle Grade Shell.... just alittle bit better than the models we have. I guess its all down to skill to them, not those fancy models that cost $1,000 USD+ we see around. LoL Attachment: Yoshida_Model.gif (Downloaded 140 times) Last edited on Fri May 9th, 2008 07:24 am by AllenZ ____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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Tsugaru Approved
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Damn. Well I just got mine in the mail this morning. I see what you mean. the plastic one is like a toy. I know Im not dropping this one haha. I better go get a case ASAP. Made from this bad boy: Hawksbill Turtle Attachment: Hawksbill_Turtle.jpg (Downloaded 138 times) Last edited on Fri May 9th, 2008 05:20 pm by Tsugaru |
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Tsugaru Approved
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AllenZ wrote: I found one of the shops the Yoshida Brother order their Bekko Bachi from..... They have on site the basic models they always buy: Can you link that site?
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AllenZ Approved
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You got your bekko bachi from your Japanese connection? Cool~ Yeah, treat it right, or it wouldn't last. How did you know its from a hawkbill turtle tho? LoL As for the Yoshida Brother's shop: http://www.bachi.jp/shohin.html I don't think they sell directly, there's a few online shops that carry their stuff, but even low grade bachi from that shop goes for $290.
____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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Tsugaru Approved
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Wow there ares some nice ones on that page. The maker does some really nice work. Some look like week old bananas haha.
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AllenZ Approved
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Mwahahaha~ Yeah they do. I think its some kind of wood handle, sure, you can brag to the people with the plastic handles about how you have a wooden handle.... but otherwise, I don't see much reason to pay a few hundred extra for it.
____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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Tsugaru Approved
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This is a great performance check it out http://youtube.com/watch?v=yf_R08-Kbvg
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AllenZ Approved
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Very Cool~ I totally dig out the Shamisen player retain Tsugaru musical style and elements without plugging in modern guitar stuff.... kinda like Kinoshita Shinichi. I respect Kinoshita over most of the performers out there because no matter what, he sticks with a traditional element in his style even if he's going against modern tunes like from a DJ or something. You can still hear the particular Tsugaru rhythm and style in his works. Not that he doesn't have the ability to break the limitation, but he seeks to challenge himself by limiting himself to sticking to tradition while making it work with the modern. I'm not a big fan of the modern stuff that step into using too much guitar elements in it..... In my opinon, why play a Shamisen like guitar when its a Shamisen? Sure, its good to try out some stuff but if you borrow too much element from something else, you lose the original. That's why I'm not a big fan of what the YBrothers is doing these days. Seriously, if I want to play guitar tunes on the Shamisen, I wouldn't had sold by Accoustics Guitar. Just my opinion.
____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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Tsugaru Approved
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Yeah I hear you. I’m a traditionalist myself, hence the whole Tsugaru Shamisen thing. I wanted to break away and go after something New and fresh. Well in Japan its more common, but NY few and far between. The YBrothers are definitely trying to get their fan base poppin. Not always a bad thing. They got me into Tsugaru Shamisen, so I love them for that. But I hear what you’re saying. Some of their western style songs are made with bad musicians. I just listen to their parts in those cases.
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momo_panda Approved
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Hi There !!!! I am a koto player from Austria, Vienna. After learning koto for some years I decided to start shamisen. Unfortunatley there is nearly no possibilities to learn or buy shamisens in my country. After searching the net, I found some shamisen sets and some books. Since you people seem familiar with shamisen related stuff, I wanted to ask you for your opinion. Since I have a lot of friends in japan, there would be a possibility, that they take it with them next time they come to europe. There is also a lot of sheet music for shamisen on the sato gakki site, but it seems no Tsugaru stile music and I desperately want to learn "Tsugaru jongara (or jonkara) bushi. Since my japanese is more based on hiragana and katakana, I also have problems to find sheet music on the net. a little help would be great. If you are interessted I could provide you guys with some koto sheet music.  best greetings from austria! Last edited on Tue Aug 5th, 2008 09:51 pm by momo_panda |
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AllenZ Approved
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Hi Momo, Please refer to the PM I sent you about stores and how I grade them. I don't want to personally diss some of the stores publicly. Most of these stores only take overseas repairs but not orders. It's best is if your friend can either help you ship them or bring it to you personal. They do not take international orders because they lose a lot of money when local post offices break the Shamisen because of their sloppy handling, and the store itself have to waste a lot of money to help you replace and reship another Shamisen to you. I myself had experienced this more than once, even though this Shamisen Shop packaged the Shamisen so well United States Postal still managed to break the top part (they break with impact like if they throw the boxes into a truck or something). Another incident is when I shipped a Shamisen of my's to a location less than 60 miles away and UPS still managed to break it under 3 layers of foam wrap and foam peanuts. Shamisens are very fragile and can't take any impact at all. Don't think its safe in a hardcase too, if impact hits the front or back surfaces, it can still break the upper sao. Like if you stand your case up to store and it topples, there's a big case of breakage. Best is to avoid mass producing Shamisen stores that get some of their Shamisens from China. Ask your friends to go to the shops to check them out first. In addition, don't go with the hypes for Ayasugi Dou or the golden pieces. It pisses me off that people listen to these hypes.
Tsugaru (the other guy on the forum) has a Karin Shamisen and it sounds great compared to a Kouki Shamisen. Tsugaru Jonkara Bushi has a lot of variations, there's no really set score for it (Different between every school and its mostly improvised). In addition, there's different scheme ones such as Old, Middle, New, New Old Tsugaru Jonkara Bushi.
____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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momo_panda Approved
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Thanks for the pm and also the many good advices. As for mass productions: my koto was a quite cheap mass product thing I bought for a dumping price, but the sound is alltogether OK. But since a concert koto costs a fortune (even more than shamisen surely) I will wait and gain some money for the day I buy one. But I guess I could also put a stick into a plastikbasket and put some twine on it, if I decide to buy a really cheap shamisen. since there are more factors that can ruin the sound quality. After listending to some Jonkara bushis I realized that there might be more than one variation.... -.- Also I have to say that I never heard of this hype. Do you mean 東サワリ付き? I read that some shamisen have it and some not? What is this?
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AllenZ Approved
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No problem. Well, the problem with mass produce that even if you are at a good level, you'll never make a good sound with it. This tends to discourages a lot of players to continue. I personally used a cheap one Made in China one before and changed after playing on a regular one since the cheap one was hindering my progress. Of course if you're really planning to get into it, I suggest you to say away from the cheap ones, especially if they say 教材用. Of course if you're experimenting, you can get one of those mass produced, synethetic skin ones (if you do, don't other buying one with the 東サワリ付き since synethetic skin doesn't not vibrate like regular skin so rendering the Azuma Sawari useless) or even try making a funny sounding homemade one. LoL You'll fine that you might be better than you are when you have hands on a decent instrument that can bring out your full potential and encourage you to work harder. I found this to be true with my Shamisen and my other instrument, the Erhu. Of course you don't need to get a pro mdoel, but a decent model would do. The stuff I mention above about the Gold Pieces and the Special Dou only apply to Redwood Models. If you don't plan to buy a Redwood Model, you can ignore them. Here's a brief explanation of a 東サワリ (Azuma Sawari) is used to cut down the excess buzz of the Shamisen. You can adjust it to either cut out the buzz entirely or just leave some of it so it can "ring" your strings. Usually you tune then adjust the 1st string's buzz so it its less, but not completely out. It's hard to explain, you want the buzz to have a level so it can spread to the other 2 strings. Even though it seems like your only adjusting the first string, it does affect the other two. It's hard to understand without hearing.
____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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JDsmash Approved
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Hello and grettings! Allow me to introduce myself, I'm a college student in southern California, call me JD. I've been playing with my school's taiko group since entering college except for a break that i took from the past year but point being I always been a big fan of Japanese culture and music. Since entering into the world of taiko I got a chance to learn about alot more traditional music from Japan, of which I learned of shamisen. Long story short, I eventually purchased my first tsugaru shamisen via email with a kinda employee at this website, for this model/set, http://www.ishibashi-webshop.jp/shop/g/g381006100/. I got this introductory model shamisen about two years ago and have since slowly but steadily made progress in trying to learn the instrument. I have a fair understanding of the different playing styles and what makes tsugaru unique amongst the others and have really come to admire the more professional performances I've been able to witness (first hand and otherwise). I'm always trying to learn more and expand upon my abilities with the shamisen but I've had trouble finding good resources in SoCal and so my progress, as I've mentioned, has been slow. But I happily found this forum and hope to continue learning as much as I can. I have only a small understanding of Japanese itself and so I'd like to ask, did I purchase a "bad" model shamisen to start out with? Granted I eventually see myself getting a newer and more proper instrument, but what are your takes on what I got from that particular website? Thanks in advanced!
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Chris Moran Approved
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Could someone direct me to a source for all-fiber or imitation ivory bachi? Thanks in advance. Last edited on Sat Oct 18th, 2008 03:04 am by Chris Moran |
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AllenZ Approved
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Hi Chris, Check eBay, I recently seen some guys selling bachis. They have quite a selection sometimes, I even seen some rare real Ivory Gidayu Shamisen ones. I personally own an imitation ivory one (象牙調 Zouge Cho) for my Nagauta Shamisen, I say its sound matches a real ivory one by 80%. A very good choice.
____________________ To hell with circumstances. I create opportunities. "You're lucky Buddhism teaches freedom from desire, because I've got the desire to kick your ass!" - Richard Gere Where I'm from? A little town called None Of Your Goddamn Business. |
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| ezFolk Forums > Other Instruments > Other Instruments > Tsugaru Shamisen | |
